Referendum

sendmyusername · Post by **sendmyusername** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 12:44 am

P.s. I'm in favour of independance.
P.p.s. Re the inherited projects - this was made from a government that wasn't answerable to the electorate as they just assumed that they would always get elected. (not a dig a labout, just that they got too comfortable)

jason · Post by **jason** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 2:18 am

Corranga wrote:
jasonliddell wrote:It saddens me that the entire debate appears to revolve purely around finances.
What should it be about?

More than exclusively about that IMHO.

If it's really 100% about finance, then we're accepting the (potential) dismantling of the Union is purely for materialistic reasons. Analogy time: would it not be considered sad if a spouse declared to their partner that they were separating solely because their salary was greater, therefore they'd be better off alone??

So, like I say, it saddens me that the debate on decision seems only about this.

robin · Post by **robin** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 7:46 am

Luckily Wikipedia has a list of countries that have gained independence from the UK. I wouldn't compare the situation of any one of the countries listed with that of Scotland.

Re: Fraking ... so what? Do you think Scotland is going to survive (energy wise) on wind and wave power? Coal? So with or without the UK, you can rest assured that in due course all politicians will conclude that Fraking is better than importing expensive fossil fuels from elsewhere, with the possible exception of the unelectable idealists.

Re: Tories selling us off were we not profitable ... countries are not for sale in that sense ... what do you actually mean?

Re: It being about more than money ... people find it hard to focus on the intangible when the tangible is, well, at hand.

If the yes campaign wanted to guarantee victory they would commit to a 5% corporation tax thus making us the new Ireland/Luxembourg. Get a few really big companies to suggest they would consider moving their taxable income into an independent Scotland under that regime. Locally we would be very rich despite not really producing all that much. Similarly compete with "The City" by making taxation structures that favour the wheeler dealers. Etc. If necessary leave Europe in order to do this.

They don't have the balls for that strategy, it seems.

Cheers,
Robin

BiggestNizzy · Post by **BiggestNizzy** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 8:08 am

robin wrote:
j2 lot wrote:I can't get my head around why SNP cancelled the Glasgow Airport rail link (although Glasgow is Labour territory ) but also heard this week that it is screwed for any future plans to resurrect it as land bought for it has now been sold off for £50k, despite it being bought for £800k+
Just sounds like normal to me. At best incompetent. At worst the other 750K found its way into just the right pockets ...

If memory serves me correctly the land was valued at £700k they overpaid to get it and then decided it wasn't needed. So they put it up for auction and nobody bought it. so they sold it back to the guy thy bought it for for £50k

tut · Post by **tut** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 9:09 am

What would Scotland use its Armed Forces for, to go to war against Switzerland because that is all it would be capable of? Denmark's would be three times larger.

We would have an Air Force but it would not fly Tornados or Typhoons. Not sure what the Tornado replaced as it is now obsolete, think it was the Lightning and Phantom, so they would need to go onto eBay to try and buy those and then we could conduct training exercises with Malawi.

Bloody joke.

tut

ps:- at least we still have Hadrians wall, bit of new brickwork and that would keep the hordes of invading English out.

BiggestNizzy · Post by **BiggestNizzy** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 9:48 am

What would we need an armed forces for, War of fish against the Faroes / Iceland ? Sure the Russians would buzz us but nobody is going to invade and I can't see us wanting to invade anyone else.

j2 lot · Post by **j2 lot** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 9:55 am

BiggestNizzy wrote:I can't see us wanting to invade anyone else.

I think we should consider having a pop at one of the Canary Islands, theyre small & it would give us somewhere to go that is warm and sunny

rad1cal · Post by **rad1cal** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 10:05 am

Corranga wrote:
jasonliddell wrote:It saddens me that the entire debate appears to revolve purely around finances.
What should it be about?

Chris

If I recall my O-grade history correctly, "finanace" was , to a large degree, why we united in the first place, having sunk over half the country's entire capital in a swamp in Central America on some "get rich quick" (darien) scheme.

I'm Scottish through and through, but I can't help reflecting on what would have happened had this referendum happened in , say, 2005 and there'd been a YES vote.

In the Euro now? -Probably
Any banks? - Probably not - (RBS and B of S bust)

History, it seems, could have repeated itself

Gareth · Post by **Gareth** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 10:52 am

BiggestNizzy wrote:What would we need an armed forces for, War of fish against the Faroes / Iceland ? Sure the Russians would buzz us but nobody is going to invade and I can't see us wanting to invade anyone else.

I believe the Russians buzz our coasts quite regularly which scrambles some of our jets.
So Lossie is staying open to support remaining Tornados and new fleet of Typhons. If Yes vote is carried what happens to that?
Without a military defense we couldn't protect ourselves. There's only one John Smeaton...

I don't see what's so bad as it is now. Yeah we all want to be taxed less but should Scotland get independence do you actually think this will be reduced?
This debate is all to do with money.

We've a decent NHS and education. Basing this on Aberdeenshire living....some moan now but can you imagine what it's like living in Birmingham/London etc.
We're in a bubble up here with good standard of living so why change?

God Save the Queen...

tut · Post by **tut** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 11:02 am

A very apt saying.......

"Better the devil you know than the devil you don't know."

tut

SAJ · Post by **SAJ** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 12:29 pm

I won't be voting for independence.

tut · Post by **tut** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 12:36 pm

Confidence.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... dence.html

tut

BiggestNizzy · Post by **BiggestNizzy** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 12:45 pm

It will be a no vote, just like the AV vote failed.

I personally hate referendums we pay politicians to make these decisions and then they pass it back onto us. I'm all for Regions with independent goverments maybe the odd dictator thrown in for good measure.

Rosssco · Post by **Rosssco** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 1:47 pm

This guy seems to think there will be no real finacial change, which are my feeling too, at least in the short term, butthout the safety net that being in the UK brings..

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... ebate.html

So most wouldn't be any better off, inequality would persist (which is fundamentally a reflection of capitalism anyway, and we know the SNP are socialist leaning..), but we wouldn't have the ecomomy of scale of government depts. (can you imagine a Scottish DVLA?

)

What's the point? I'm not going to feel anymore Scottish having a Scottish passport, EU rules (assuming we are still in) will mean people in the UK can still come here work / live. I'll just feel that a union of countries that has worked so well for so long has been broken up by a minorities misty-eyed views fo events that happened around half a millenia ago. Things are different now.

I personally think Salmond knows he will win regardless - in a 'naw' vote, Devomax powers will have been touted by the UK government, thus the Scottish parliment will grow in power. And if there is a no vote, can we insist that the issue isn't raised for another min. ~30 years so that all politicians can remain focused on the real job they are elected to do, rather than one fundamental policy of one political party..

mckeann · Post by **mckeann** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 3:19 pm

Rosssco wrote: I'll just feel that a union of countries that has worked so well for so long has been broken up by a minorities misty-eyed views fo events that happened around half a millenia ago. Things are different now.

couldnt have put it better myself Rosssco

Scottish Elises

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