Shouting at the F1 Qualifying...

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Scottd
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Post by Scottd » Sun Aug 05, 2007 6:39 am

robin wrote:As for all the cheating comments about various other drivers, come on.

The game is about taking the rules to the limit. Each car stretches the technical regulations to the limit and winning drivers stretch the rules to the limit on the track - Schumacher was very good at that, but he isn't the only one to do it.

The teams see everything that happens, and there are plenty of spotters about the track. The teams aren't slow to complain if they think someone is cheating or abusing the rules so when they keep quiet I assume it's because they agree that the driving is within the rules.

Cheers,
Robin

I would agree with what you're saying if you were describing an even playing field, but it's not. Ferrari have a veto over any FIA ruling. So are not only unpunishable (unless it's really, really blatant) but they can hold up new regulations that may not favour the direction they are taking their cars.
also.. if Ferrari came last out of every team in F1 this year, then they still get more money than the team that wins.


But anyways, I was starting to think, maybe I remember things wrongly, maybe he didn’t cheat more than any other driver in history and nearly ruin the sport, maybe every other F1 team wanting to make a break-away F1 were wrong, so I decided to type “schumacher cheatâ€

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Scottd
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Post by Scottd » Sun Aug 05, 2007 6:40 am

BiggestNizzy wrote:Unsporting only equals cheating if your german ;)
If you're one particular German who did it more than anyone else in the history of the sport to the point of putting other peoples lives at risk.

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Scottd
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Post by Scottd » Sun Aug 05, 2007 6:47 am

woody wrote:
mac wrote:I'm blinkered for thinking that what's good for one is good for the other???

Checked F1.com and there's no mention of Alonso being dock places.


I'm also suprised the Renault driver got away with blocking the Torro Rosso driver in Q1 - they punished DC heavily for less earlier in the season.


Mac
Alsonso has been demoted to 6th on the grid. McLaren will not be awarded any constructors points if they are in a position to score any:


http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/61373
I'm over the moon w that on the one hand but at the same time McLaren getting no constuctors points at all seems a tad harsh! Their car's the wrong colour :D

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tut
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Post by tut » Sun Aug 05, 2007 8:48 am

Great stuff..........

It was a stupid and unsporting stunt that Alonso attempted, so he is now paying for it.

His excuse was even more pathetic, "I was waiting to see if they had fitted the correct tyre." Its one thing trying to pull one off against another team, but against your own team mate?

As Robin said, how impressed is Ron with his driver now that thay will score no Championship points.

As I said, great stuff............

tut

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jason
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Post by jason » Sun Aug 05, 2007 9:18 am

I'm pleased the stewards saw through the ridiculous, unbelievable spin Ron and Alonso put on it...

...but I can't help thinking

(a) the no constructors' points is a bit harsh (but perhaps intended to 'encourage' McLaren to take Alonso's behavious more seriously)

and

(b) Alonso's punishment is quite lenient. Where did this arbitrary 5 grid places come from? He could realistically be 3rd tomorrow - maybe even 2nd if things work out for him. If he hindered a competitor, and acted 'against the sport' then surely a last place (like Schumacher in Monaco) would have been more appropriate.

Anyway - at least some justice has been done :thumbsup

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Post by Dominic » Sun Aug 05, 2007 9:42 am

jasonliddell wrote:I'm pleased the stewards saw through the ridiculous, unbelievable spin Ron and Alonso put on it...

...but I can't help thinking

(a) the no constructors' points is a bit harsh (but perhaps intended to 'encourage' McLaren to take Alonso's behavious more seriously)

and

(b) Alonso's punishment is quite lenient. Where did this arbitrary 5 grid places come from? He could realistically be 3rd tomorrow - maybe even 2nd if things work out for him. If he hindered a competitor, and acted 'against the sport' then surely a last place (like Schumacher in Monaco) would have been more appropriate.

Anyway - at least some justice has been done :thumbsup
:withstupid

I'm watching GP2 on eurosport just now. What great racing! The commentators keep rubishing F1, but when you see the overtaking going on in GP2, you can see why. Reverse grids on 2 race format makes sense!
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Post by Lawrence » Sun Aug 05, 2007 10:24 am

This whole circle of events at qualifying started with golden Boy Hamilton failing to honour the alternating fuel burn instructions that gave Alonso the opportunity for an extra lap of fuel at this event. Clearly when one messes with a 2 time world champion then there'll be repercussions, what galls me is that Hamilton now gets an advantage from his complete disregard to his teams instructions, but then all the really greats seem to have such good luck.

I wonder that in a few years we will think exactly the same of him as we think of 7 times champion Schumacher. It's not sport at all is it? and they're all as bad as each other ;)

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Post by mac » Sun Aug 05, 2007 10:46 am

Just give Hamilton the title just now.

Between Dennis & Mossley it's been pretty much stitched up now anyway.

I can't believe they have demoted Alonso!!

What's next??? Will a driver be punished for coming into the pits in front of Hamilton and doing 2mph under the speed limit?


The guy is talented for sure, but he's not yet a "great" in motorsport - I just wonder what other countries that might not be swept up the nationalism of it all will have made of the last few races.


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Post by BiggestNizzy » Sun Aug 05, 2007 11:25 am

it does stink a bit of favoritism.

and it's beginning to ruin what has been the best season in years
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Post by k12chu » Sun Aug 05, 2007 5:33 pm

k12chu wrote:
John Reid wrote:Frustration perhaps at the press hype... I would love Hamilton to turn round and say something that bursts the "good boy" image. Then perhaps we will get more balanced comentary.

He cant stay the good boy forever. He needs to get agresive and start working on the intimidation. Nobody on track is flustered by him. Schumacher could almost scare people off the track...
but u see... Hamilton is "BRITISH" and as long as he remains british... the press will keep him right on the top. if he made a wrong statement, they will cover for him. no doubts about it!!
early this year, the F1 magazine had an article about Jenson Button. they said he was the best F1 driver in 2006. they claim that because, he was the only driver to complete the last 6 races in 2006. that shows consistency (schumacher and alonso werent :roll: )
well... cant say any more

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Post by tut » Sun Aug 05, 2007 6:49 pm

Thats about it Lawrence. But unless it can ever get back to just racing, then you will have this crap.

Its not difficult for gods sake, get in the car, drive as fast as you can, and you will get a result. OK, that is as it used to be, but no more.

Could you possibly have a more boring race than todays? Hamilton lead from start to finish, Raikonen was between 4 and 1 secs behind, with no chance of overtaking, even if he had got close enough, it was a bloody procession.

tut

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Post by BiggestNizzy » Sun Aug 05, 2007 7:30 pm

tut wrote:Thats about it Lawrence. But unless it can ever get back to just racing, then you will have this crap.

Its not difficult for gods sake, get in the car, drive as fast as you can, and you will get a result. OK, that is as it used to be, but no more.

Could you possibly have a more boring race than todays? Hamilton lead from start to finish, Raikonen was between 4 and 1 secs behind, with no chance of overtaking, even if he had got close enough, it was a bloody procession.

tut
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Did I mention before that they should reduce downforce.
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Post by woody » Sun Aug 05, 2007 8:23 pm

BiggestNizzy wrote:
tut wrote:Thats about it Lawrence. But unless it can ever get back to just racing, then you will have this crap.

Its not difficult for gods sake, get in the car, drive as fast as you can, and you will get a result. OK, that is as it used to be, but no more.

Could you possibly have a more boring race than todays? Hamilton lead from start to finish, Raikonen was between 4 and 1 secs behind, with no chance of overtaking, even if he had got close enough, it was a bloody procession.

tut
:withstupid:

Did I mention before that they should reduce downforce.
I'd take the contrary view:

The more and more things have been banned and/or restricted, the less 'real' racing there has been. If you could imagine a 2000hp turbo car, active suspension car with wings tied to the suspension , full ground effect etc.... I'd bet that the racing would be a lot more interesting. IMO, the restrictions on the cars have left to be evolved; the same basic car is honed, re-honed and worked over again for every new season as the rules are no longer open enough to encourace genuinely new innovatons. When was the last big innovation that was actually allowed to stand more than a few races that significantly moved the cars on? (electronics excepted perhaps, but as the FIA admitted they don't know all of what happening, and thus allowed TC, how are we to know?) Engine's lasting more than one race have compounded this further as teams look to save engines for the next weekend. As far ago as 1984 (I was 2, so it's what I've read) Chapman complained that the sport was no longer the fertile breeding ground of new ideas it had been when he started, mostly due to over regulation on the technical side. IIRC this was when his Type 88 twin chassis car was banned. Anyway it's my opinion the stagnation encouraged by the regulations coupled with the massive advances in aerodynamics have left the cars so close, yet unable to actually race. Fitting smaller wings wouldn't actually change that much.

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RANT!

Post by BiggestNizzy » Sun Aug 05, 2007 9:22 pm

The problem with all these goodies is money, it cost a feck load of cash to implement these things and gets drivers killed. I do agree that F1 has stagnated regards innovation now it's just a case of honeing the cars to perfection. My thinking behind the reduction in downforce it to try and spur innovation on make the designers rethink what they are doing come up with new idea's. I agree that things are becoming over regulated (like most things ion this world) F1 needs a rethink and that will not happen is anyone going to risk something new when millions of pounds are involved ? last year renault where running a different front suspension system they had put alot of time and effort into it and it was working well. it wasn't a secret it wasn't against the rules and if any other team wanted to go down the route they could. So what did the FIA do ? they banned it ! why ? who knows (maybe ferrari said so :P ) F1 has become a sport where inovation is stamped out where image is everything and the race has become secondary. That is why it has become dull and we applaud a guy who drove all they way to the finish without ever being tested, without the chance of him being overtaken.

I just wish it would p*ss with rain every race then maybe it would be worth watching.
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GregR
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Post by GregR » Sun Aug 05, 2007 9:22 pm

quit yer whinging, it was a good race ;)
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