catherham

[robin]

From Marussia perspective this is probably smart tactics if they need to save money. They are allowed to miss up to three races, I believe. By not entering they save a lot of money on expenses, etc., yet it is unlikely to affect their position in the manufacturers' championship. Sauber are a threat, but they would need to finish 8th in order to take that position in the manufacturers' championship. Barring huge first corner accidents that is very unlikely.

Of course it's a moot point if they fail to appear next year! Hopefully somebody will come along and buy up the team.

Caterham appear to be dead, though - if you were going to buy a team, you would buy Marussia - and Caterham will disintegrate further each passing day.

Cheers,
Robin

[campbell]

Ref Caterham, Joe Saward laying it firmly at The Administrator's inexperience.

[robin]

Yeah, I don't see it that way. The administrator's job is pretty clear. Any effort to run the team as a team (vs. as a pile of potential assets to be secured) is a gamble with the very assets that might pay the creditors out. Realistically Caterham aren't going to outscore Marussia - so any money spent now on trying to "win" 10th place and thus the $90m is a big gamble. Any buyer worth their salt knows that they will get the best price once the whole thing has gone bang. Thus a quick route to liquidation is probably going to be best for the creditors. Everyone else has had their chance and either doesn't want to or cannot put up the money. The race entry is obviously worth something, but as Bernie wants at least 20 cars on the grid, you have to think a new team would be able to buy the Caterham entry either from Caterham/administrator or from F1.com, thus the race entry isn't going to be worth that much to a new buyer in current conditions.

Cheers,
Robin

[robin]

Another one bites the dust:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-ox ... e-29784602

Cheers,
Robin

[campbell]

I was going to mention RIP Marussia earlier

[robin]

As a team they had more going for them than Caterham, IMHO.

[j2 lot]

Sad as I am to see them go they really didnt bring anything to the table apart from numbers as neither have shown any real consistency or development in form.
I reckon the only way to develop and expand with new teams is as a nursery to the big players much as Torro Rosso is to Red Bull but I guess funding isnt available for that to happen.

[Mikie711]

Sad as I am to see them go they really didnt bring anything to the table apart from numbers as neither have shown any real consistency or development in form.
I reckon the only way to develop and expand with new teams is as a nursery to the big players much as Torro Rosso is to Red Bull but I guess funding isnt available for that to happen.

The talk of the main teams moving to 3 car line ups then surely it isn't that much more expensive to run 4 cars. 2 in the main team and 2 in a satellite team. They could use second tier tech from the main company and be used to break in new driving talent, pay for your seat drivers etc.
It's always going to be a 2 tier stage anyway, between the have and the have nots, so may as well be sustainable.

[campbell]

F1 is just too expensive to operate in.

Which was the last "new" team to be successful? Red Bull, I guess? With massive resources to deploy from the outset.

Before them? Not sure there has been one in the post-80s turbo era...

[robin]

Yes, but the strings they can then pull means you get unfair tactics in races. Already you would think that if push came to shove Torro Rosso would position their cars to assist Red Bull if required (i.e. let RB past quickly, then hold up the next car for as long as possible). At places like Monaco that can make a big difference.

If the top four teams each have a "satellite" team then effectively (a) the currently competitive mid field is always out of the points and (b) there would be a lot of scope for unsporting tactics.

I don't agree with everything Joe Saward has to say, (though he clearly has a lot better insight than I do!), but I think he's right to suggest that a cost cap is required and that one component of such a cost cap could be to limit the cost of a customer engine.

If any team could buy a set of mercedes engines for $5m a season, it would make life a lot easier (and there would be more competition in due course).

Cheers,
Robin

[j2 lot]

Caterham have just announced that they have raised sufficient funds to race in Abu Dhabi

[campbell]

And an interesting further angle...

http://joesaward.wordpress.com/2014/11/ ... eal-world/

[robin]

What on earth is going on here ... now they are racing, but have made all the staff redundant, but will hire enough to go to this one race on short term arrangement and now Bernie puts his hand in his pocket and gives them free passage to AD. Why wait until after the fact to offer any support? Why are they even going? And WTF is going on with Alonso & BigRon? Is it some sort of set up? Who is setting who up? ... confused, you won't be after watching this week's episode of soap ..

soap

Cheers,
Robin

[Rag_It]

Yes, but the strings they can then pull means you get unfair tactics in races. Already you would think that if push came to shove Torro Rosso would position their cars to assist Red Bull if required (i.e. let RB past quickly, then hold up the next car for as long as possible). At places like Monaco that can make a big difference.
Cheers,
Robin

Interesting point Robin, but i would have thought that Monaco would be one of the last circuits that this would come into play, with little chance for over-taking, TR cars assisting RB cars would help very little, no?

[jason]

Yes, but the strings they can then pull means you get unfair tactics in races. Already you would think that if push came to shove Torro Rosso would position their cars to assist Red Bull if required (i.e. let RB past quickly, then hold up the next car for as long as possible). At places like Monaco that can make a big difference.
Cheers,
Robin

Interesting point Robin, but i would have thought that Monaco would be one of the last circuits that this would come into play, with little chance for over-taking, TR cars assisting RB cars would help very little, no?

It's always going to be to your advantage to have 'friends' on track.

In the Monaco scenario, it could be a Ferrari leading a Red Bull. Ferrari pits first, comes out behind a Torro Rosso (which is leading the Ferrari in the race now). TR then drops pace just enough to ensure Red Bull leap frogs said Ferrari when it pits a few laps later. Easily masqueraded as tyre nursing, fuel management, whatever. Simples.

I hate the notion of top teams being 3-car, and hate junior teams too (eg. TR). It's an unequal situation.