Scottish Elises

Folks,

I recently had a set of Pagid RS-42's break up on me, they were 2-3k old and hadn't been subject to any wheel cleaner. There also seemed to be plenty of "meat" left in them
....as such I returned them to the supplier/manufacturer who gave this reply....

Supplier response :


"Thanks for returning the E1587 RS4-2 with the comments that the pad material is breaking up! A quick visual inspection shows a 1 pad displays surface cracking which is visual rather than functional.

Firstly I measured the thickness of the pads, this varied on all 4 pads, between 9.1mm and 10.4mm. The recommended minimum thickness that PAGID recommend is 4mm of friction material remaining on the pad, and when the backing plate thickness is also included, which in this case is 5.1mm this gives a minimum thickness of 9.1mm. So the pads are worn to the limit, which in itself creates less mass to dissipate the thermal energy generated during braking, so the pad material runs hotter the thinner it gets. While I don’t think that is the only cause of the problem, it does contribute to the problem.

Another cause of surface fractures is rapid rises and falls of temperature which creates thermal shock resulting in small surface cracks that get progressively worse, this is a common phenomena during race and circuit use, and can also be seen during extreme road use. For this purpose PAGID use an exclusive mechanical attachment method to prevent de-lamination from the backing plate, so surface cracks do appear, but don’t present a problem.

The next most popular cause of pad material corrosion and ultimately surface cracking is the use of corrosive wheel cleaner which penetrates the friction material and can cause cracks and crumbling of the binders that hold the friction material together.

So, probably a combination of 2 of the above criteria.

Hope this goes some way to explaining what is likely to have occurred here, but does in no way present a problem in wither performance or safety, as there are measures in place to prevent de-lamination if operating conditions create such issues."

FYI
BTW this isn't a complaint re the supplier or manufacturer, but I certainly wasn't aware of it!

Biggest load of crap that I have read for a long time.

Especially at the speeds that you drive...........

Pursue them.

tut

I intend to......looks pointless though!

tut wrote:Especially at the speeds that you drive...........

Kenny uses your lines....so now you use his?

So they are recommending that the minimum thickness of material is 4mm? What do they start at 6-7mm?

VXJON wrote:

So they are recommending that the minimum thickness of material is 4mm? What do they start at 6-7mm?

Tenkfeet should be along shortly to tell us!

Geary is now saying that RS-14's would be better for me......I disagree! Opinions?

meatball wrote: Geary is now saying that RS-14's would be better for me......I disagree! Opinions?

The RS-14's are without doubt fantastic pads on the track, so much so that you will probably overheat your discs before reaching the fade point on the pads, but on the road they are a very expensive option - When I ran the rs14 pads, i'd be changing a set of discs with every set of pads as they are very abrasive, esp when not up to temperature.

I moved onto the SBS compounds and am very happy.

How long were the RS42's on the car? Lost count of how many sets I have been through and most get a reasonably hard time. A few have been cracked when they come off, were yours cracked or crumbling?

Would tend to agree slightly with the above, once the Pagids wear down they are rubbish, the last trackday when I changed pads midway through the difference was night and day, pads still had a few mil left on them.

I think I put them on at the end of march.....I covered approx 2-3k.......one pad had cracked, and looked as if it was set to crumble!

Nah that ain't normal wear. Not for you anyway

kenny wrote:Nah that ain't normal wear. Not for you anyway

As in....they should have lasted decades?
see my sig!

Would tend to agree slightly with the above

I'd see about 10k out a set of 14's - something doesn't sound right here.....

My RS42s lasted 3 track days plus not so many road miles. The pads were crumbling (over heating) when taken out and as expected did not stop the car.

Mind you I did a number of endurance sessions (i.e. 45+ consecutive KH laps - much longer than an average race). The RS14s are lasting longer but they are not kind to the stock cheese disks.

meatball wrote:

VXJON wrote:

So they are recommending that the minimum thickness of material is 4mm? What do they start at 6-7mm?

Tenkfeet should be along shortly to tell us!

Geary is now saying that RS-14's would be better for me......I disagree! Opinions?

On the new pads I have material thickness is 9.5mm ( approx cant find my caliper).

So you buy a new set of very expensive pads and you can only officially use half of them. Ive found that mine last around the same as a standard set of pads so to effectivly compare pagids with standard you would have to double the price of the pagids and they are already twice the price!