B & C Conversions

[Chewitt13]

Need some advice

got a straight S2 with aftermarket induction and exhaust. wanting to get a little more power/ acceleration 0-60, i do'nt do trackdays so it is only for road use, i have been looking into the B&C conversion to 160BHP for 3.5k, is this any good, will i notice the performance difference or should i save my pennies and go the full on honda root.

[graeme]

PTP would get my money.

http://www.ptp-ltd.co.uk/shop/productsl ... election=2

(scroll down that page for a list of kits)

PTP170 kit for the S2 with all the trimmings will set you back less than £3k and will be really nice on the road, with extra power right in the overtaking range. Honda won't be less than £9k and will break. A lot. Sure, it'll be quicker, but not £6k+ quicker!

/2p

[mckeann]

PTP would get my money.

http://www.ptp-ltd.co.uk/shop/productsl ... election=2

(scroll down that page for a list of kits)

PTP170 kit for the S2 with all the trimmings will set you back less than £3k and will be really nice on the road, with extra power right in the overtaking range. Honda won't be less than £9k and will break. A lot. Sure, it'll be quicker, but not £6k+ quicker!

/2p

HAHAHAHAHA, what are you basing this on exactly Graeme. For reference, my K let me down a hell of a lot more than my honda has.


Also, without sounding too much like a honda fan boy, i didnt really notice the jump in performance that much upto 160bhp, especially on the road.


Personally, if i was doing it again, i would strip some weight out of the car, and buy decent suspension. This will be much more satisfying on the road, as the standard engine has lots of torque where you need it, a tuned K moves it up the rev range. great on track, not on the road

[ryallm]

If you do a search on Seloc you will find that the B&C conversion does not have a very good reputation -apparantly it is more like 140bhp with bugger all torque. Since you have already got the zorst and induction I would just get the head ported to take it up to the equivalent of an S2 135 (used to own one of these). This makes the engine rev a lot more freely above 5k without compromising the mid range and should be cheap to do. Next upgrade would be suspension as mentioned above and maybe sticky tyres.

Mark

[mckeann]

if you absolutely must go for more power, then what Robin has done to EGOR is probably the best way to do it

[Chewitt13]

I'm a complete Retard at engines, obviously missed that bit at uni. (Mech Eng)

Porting the head???? is this expensive, is it something ricky gauld could do?

ive done the new wheels+tyres thing and replaced the interior trim with the leather one from a 111S

Looking at the PTP website, there are about 6 version of the RS170 kit ranging from 1.5k to 3.5k but all promising 170 horses, how does that work?

sort of hoping that by improving the car i have i will not have a spur of the moment purchase of a new SC exige jobby

[mac]

PTP would get my money.

http://www.ptp-ltd.co.uk/shop/productsl ... election=2

(scroll down that page for a list of kits)

PTP170 kit for the S2 with all the trimmings will set you back less than £3k and will be really nice on the road, with extra power right in the overtaking range. Honda won't be less than £9k and will break. A lot. Sure, it'll be quicker, but not £6k+ quicker!

/2p

HAHAHAHAHA, what are you basing this on exactly Graeme. For reference, my K let me down a hell of a lot more than my honda has.

Perhaps conversations with me?

The 165ptp kit fitted to "our" elise worked flawlessly and on a rolling road produced 164.9bhp.

The was also an increase in midrange torque without making the engine to peaky which helped on the road.

Robin's found a different route which I think is cheaper so perhaps a chat with him would be a good idea.

[mckeann]

He said the honda will break. a lot. Is that what your conversation covered?? In that case, what are you basing this on Mac?

[mac]

Never read the will break, a lot bit.

I tend not to be able to read any more than a few line of Graeme's postings before going into a trance




Mac

[GregR]

Robin has done a great job on his car, but has helped out Campbell, DDtB and I get a great power hike for relatively little cash.

I had a head sent to Rog in Wisbech (of Sabre heads) for porting, larger valves put in, and slightly hotter cams. I'm pretty sure that alone gives in the region of 150bhp. No need for verniers or a new ECU.

I'd steer clear of B&C conversions, they rarely do what they say on the tin - IIRC a B&C 160 is about 140bhp at the flywheel.

Adding a 4-2-1 manifold also helps.

now i think about it, I reckon Ali at SLS is worth a call. I'm sure he mentioned doing that sort of conversion 'all in' when I spoke to him last...£3.5k is about double what I'd expect it to cost, on a bad day!

Mac - have you got the 165 head back on yet?

[ryallm]

I'm a complete Retard at engines, obviously missed that bit at uni. (Mech Eng)

Porting the head???? is this expensive, is it something ricky gauld could do?

Porting just means grinding/smoothing the inlet and exhaust ports in the cylinder head to maximise gas flow. It is a skilled job, but it shouldn't be be too expensive. The only real difference between a standard S2 and the factory 135 is that the later is ported (the induction and exhaust mods sound good but little else) - having driven them both back to back I would say it makes a very noticable improvement at the top end.

I am sure Robin will be along shortly to tell how it really should be done though

Mark

[Shug]

He said the honda will break. a lot. Is that what your conversation covered?? In that case, what are you basing this on Mac?

Lets not f**king start this again.

ANY tuned car is less reliable, whether it's the engine itself (K) or ancilliary bits stressed with the extra power (honda) Let's leave it at that please.

[robin]

PTP170 is a good kit, except it's terrible idle and somewhat poor fuel consumption.

If you want to keep the standard S2 engine management system (and that's a good idea) I think around 150 is the limit.

I would suggest swapping the head for gas flowed head with bigger intake valves and mildly tuned cams and then keep the standard intake/exhaust manifolds plus your go-faster air box and back box.

Campbell & Greg both have this type of cylinder head; the former with standard everything, the latter plus mild cams. I know Campbell's car makes 140+BHP and I guess Greg's isn't far off 150. They're both S1's, though, which use a different ECU, so I cannot swear that the very same results will be found on an S2.

I have an S2 135R which has a different map in it from the factory, so although my car makes 160BHP (with quite a lot more work and bits fitted to it than either of those two) I don't think one can assume a normal S2 would make the same on a standard ECU.

Ricky can do the fitting (as can Ali at SLS no doubt).

You can either get him to remove the head and send it away, or you can do a p/x deal on your existing head - Ali @ SLS should be getting a modified head to the right spec into stock in the near future and has cams in stock now (last time I checked, anyway) - he will no doubt p/x your old head against it when the time comes - you would have to speak to him about retail pricing, but I would expect a built head with the mildly tuned cams to come it around 1000 quid p/x against old head and cams.

I am pretty sure you won't regret it

Cheers,
Robin

[mckeann]

He said the honda will break. a lot. Is that what your conversation covered?? In that case, what are you basing this on Mac?

Lets not f**king start this again.

ANY tuned car is less reliable, whether it's the engine itself (K) or ancilliary bits stressed with the extra power (honda) Let's leave it at that please.

CALM DOWN DEAR

[Chewitt13]

Cheers Robin

SLS?

as i said im not looking for super performance, i.e. the standard car is still better then my driving ability. would just like a little bit more for overtaking.

a grand or so is easily manageable.