Scottish Elises

https://www.pistonheads.com/features/ph ... t-rs/38097

Cayman GTS v Exige Sport 410 v Audi TT RS

Interesting read.

Great car but optioned up as per the test and it's £103k

We might need to stop bashing the pricing. Are we all living back in the 90s? An Esprit then was what, £60k? At a modest RPI of 2% pa that's £87.4k in today's money.

Is a fully optioned top of the range Exige S worth £20k more than an Esprit in its day and age? Well I've only driven an Esprit so can't compare but I'm going to suggest if quite possibly is.

I think the Elise 1.6 was around £35k before they dropped it. An S1 with a few options was £25k in 1999. That's £32k now. Not far off.

I love the v6 Exige in all flavours, and it is a great result, but.... i struggle to see more than 1% of Cayman buyers considering one. An Evora seems a far more logical combatant?

I think a lot of earlier Lotus buyers have moved up to the Exige S. You kinda have to "get it", I think??

Doc883 wrote: ↑

Mon May 28, 2018 4:51 pm

Great car but optioned up as per the test and it's £103k

How many are going to option it up to £103k though? About all I'd put on it would be air con and a stereo so you're looking at £87k. Still a lot of money but it looks like a hell of a car.

The mistake was in Lotus supplying a test car that was so spec'd up, well, that and Pistonheads doing a group test with 3 cars that are so far apart that, you could have 2 of the TT RS with some options ticked for the price of the tested Exige!
Even the Cayman as spec'd in the test is almost £10k less than the BASE Exige Sport 410. The Sport 350 would have made more sense, as the article mentions.

The 410 is closer in price to the V10 R8 than the TT RS, and the 911 Carrera S is the same price as the 410.

So, should we criticise Lotus pricing...? Well, certainly their residuals are impeccable right now. Nothing older than 5 years seems to be depreciating, and that, in part surely is related to the high prices of new models, but also, if they were overly priced, the residuals would drop like a stone.
Also, they must be selling them, and as long as they can, they continue to make cars. Selling 1,500 £80k cars a year is better than selling 1,500 £40k cars a year when the basis of your cars, as is the case with Lotus, is so similar, which suggests the margins are better on the more expensive models.

For me, it's a shame they don't offer a cheaper entry level car. As it is, I doubt I'll ever be able to afford an £80k car (never mind the spec'd up £103k varient!) and with residuals being so good, the older cars I can afford are just getting older still.
Meanwhile, I've shifted to a Maserati, which part of me sees as a stepping stone towards an Evora, and even typing that seems a little crazy

Entry level question is interesting.

They tried hard with the 1.6. But it's recently been (quietly) withdrawn. So entry level is now the supercharged S at around £40k.

You have lots of wider choices for £40k but I challenge anyone to find something that stops, goes and steers quite like an Elise in that price bracket. OTOH they are relatively niche cars so it can be less about price point competition and more about emotion plus ownership experience. I think (and hope!) that owning an Elise S will cost a lot less than an equivalently endowed Boxster or TTS Roadster. We shall see eh...!

How much is the cheapest Evora?

Surly that's a closer rival to the Cayman?

I'd imagine if you want to concentrate specifically on driving, a Caterham, and various other things like the Caterham come into play.

Every car is a compromise. You have to compromise somewhere. Price will almost always be the imposed compromise.

The beauty of the Elise (and indeed most Lotus) is that they win at the car compromise game for people like us.
They can be used everyday (if need be) in relative comfort, and rock up at the track, or your favourite road and excel there too.
They are reliable, and relatively cheap to run. More than that, they aren't that fragile. You can stick an Elise on a track for an hour and rely on it to get you home.

Once upon a time, Lotus was muttered as a more expensive alternative to an MX-5, first with the Elan M100, and then the Elise. Now you can buy 2 MX-5s and still have £8k left over for some options on those MX-5. Don't get me wrong, I don't want to get into a debate about how Lotus will never compete with the MX-5 - that's not what I'm thinking. Lotus are niche, and it's a niche I like, but their niche has moved from
"Let's grab a small percentage of those mx-5 sales - people who want a great, fun car, but are willing to compromise the money, stretching a bit further for a better driving experience."
to
"Let's grab a small percentage of those Cayman sales - people who want a great, fun car, but are willing to compromise the money, stretching a bit further for a better driving experience."

I'm just bitter, I can't afford a Cayman in the first place

The problem with the 1.6 is that it didn't really move the game on.
It tried to mirror the S1, creating the modern equivalent in terms of most things.
Price - adjusted for inflation.
Performance - very much same.
Handling - similar but probably worse due to additional weight.
Weight - similar, plus modern safety and some spec change etc.
Whilst every other car has moved cheaper, faster etc.

Mike Scib wrote: ↑

Tue May 29, 2018 2:00 pm

How much is the cheapest Evora?

Surly that's a closer rival to the Cayman?

A base Cayman (so not the GTS) is less than £45k. That's entry level Supercharger Elise S money

Corranga wrote: ↑

Tue May 29, 2018 9:26 am

The Sport 350 would have made more sense, as the article mentions.

Yep. In the comments the writer notes they tried to get a Sport 350 (which would be the natural competitor on price) but they were only given the Sport 410, no doubt because Lotus are pushing their new model. A Sport 380 / 410 / 430 areGT3/GT4 competitors really.

Plus, you could strip out about £15k of carbon tat and titanium exhaust options off that price.

If your aiming upmarket it doesn't help your cause to have to have a cheap version of the expensive car as it undermines the big spend. Possibly against the odds Lotus managed to push the range upmarket so if they want a cheap model it has to be new, but not to similar to the rest of the range or customers will go low.

campbell wrote: ↑

Mon May 28, 2018 9:08 pm

I think the Elise 1.6 was around £35k before they dropped it. An S1 with a few options was £25k in 1999. That's £32k now. Not far off.

Was £32K iirrc but of course soon adds up to £35k if you ad leather seats, aircon, sound proofing and thats before paint, hard top and all the other options. So certainly on par with prices 20 yrs ago .