F1

[tut]

Gone off Vettel, too bloody cocky.

Quite happy to see him cock up again, but if he doesn't he will probably win.

tut

[Edin430]

C'mon Mclaren!

[tonyg]

As expected - first corner excitement followed by high speed advertising procession.

[kenny]

Team orders again at Ferrari making a mockery of the sport, what a shower of sh*t they are.

[Edin430]

you beat me to it kenny - alonso is a proper w@nk

[tut]

What a bloody farce, back to the old days. Would loved to have heard Massa say fcuk off.

Would the old Schumacher have moved over?

tut

ps Rob Smedley is a good guy. Can you imagine how he feels being forced to say that?

[Lazydonkey]

I think his face on the pit wall said it all.

What a farce

[duggiesmith]

Wouldn't be surprised if Ferrari get a penalty. That was blatant team orders.
See Vettel was up to his usual tricks at the start.

[j2 lot]

A hollow victory and a lot of frowns in Ferrari. I hope they get a penalty - to make it so blatant makes a mockery of the sport

[Lazydonkey]

TBH im not that bothered about team orders as such - thye've been about for years. What im more concerned about is that a rule is introduced to prevent it and people dont comply.

I dont think the rule is correct, but it is a rule.

[tut]

Exactly and it was so blatant. Everybody wants to see racing. If Alonso was faster then he should prove it by passing him.

Would be great to see Ferrari now excluded from the results.

tut

[Corranga]

TBH im not that bothered about team orders as such - thye've been about for years. What im more concerned about is that a rule is introduced to prevent it and people dont comply.

I dont think the rule is correct, but it is a rule.

Team orders have been around for years, and the rule is stupid, especially when combined with the new points structure. Even F1 nice-guy David Coulthard is in support of it!
Massa has been rubbish this season up til now and Alonso clearly has a better points position, and a chance for the championship.
Combine this with what happens with team mates when they race one another as Vettel / Webber have pointed out this year already.

It does make the victory seem pretty stale though, but better both cars finishing than a hot headed driver taking them both out.

Interesting also that this is seen as team orders, but a team removing part of one drivers car and putting it on another isn't?
And is anyone going to stand up and say that Button not making a move on Hamilton in that whole race is out of his kindness and not some McLaren 'don't take each other out' type order...?

Chris

[Lazydonkey]

And is anyone going to stand up and say that Button not making a move on Hamilton in that whole race is out of his kindness and not some McLaren 'don't take each other out' type order...?

Granted i was watching it with french commentary but i think i missed the bit where Button was all over the back of Hamilton and had to back off for the sake of the team?

He drove a good race but he wasn't ever in a position to pass hamilton IMHO

Telling someone to back off is one thing but telling someone to move over is another thing entirely.

[j2 lot]

Telling drivers not to take each other off is sensible - telling a driver to let his teammate past is against the rules.
Break the rules and you should be penalised.

[robin]

Who cares? It makes no difference to the results, except that Alonso gets some more points and Massa gets fewer - that was a potential outcome in any case.

Here's the question - when it's the last race of the year, Hamilton needs 3 points to win the championship (from Vettel or Alonso, if you like) and Button is in his way for 8th place or whatever 3 points equates to - will you be surprised to see Button move over for Hamilton? Will you be upset by that move? Will it be team orders? I suspect nobody will say anything much about it, and what they do say will be broadly positive (except the Vettel and Alonso fans, of course, who will be screaming about team orders ....).

My view is that when two cars from the same team are next to each other on the circuit they can finish in whatever order they want and no rules will prevent that; they could simply have told Massa to push, then told him to save fuel; that would have had the same effect. Massa elected to let Alonso pass because it was the right thing for the team - his choice and makes sod all difference to anybody else.

Cheers,
Robin