Just had an off, need help

[Bada Bing!]

If you skidded then the brakes where working - it was the interface between brain-pedal-tyre-road that failed.


Mac

Agreed, but I have found recently that doing emergency stops at speeds around say 40 or 50mph the brakes are ruddy useless unless they're warm. If I apply the same pressure when they're warm at motorway speeds, the pedal firms up and I get that satisfying feedback through the pedal as the car comes to a stop very quickly.

I just need to bear in mind that unless I'm working my brakes as well as I'm working the engine, then I may not stop in time.

When you say useless - can you still lock the wheels? Or is it they lock at differing pedal presure.

This is one thing that Walshy days are great for - learning how to brake in an non assisted car and practicing emergency stops/hard braking which most folk don't.


Cheers


Mac

Yep, the wheels will still lock (then ABS unlocks them), it could be ABS is too premature at low speeds actually. The car just goes on for far longer than it should if I jam on the anchors at speeds below 40 or 50.

[Shug]

Agreed, but I have found recently that doing emergency stops at speeds around say 40 or 50mph the brakes are ruddy useless unless they're warm. If I apply the same pressure when they're warm at motorway speeds, the pedal firms up and I get that satisfying feedback through the pedal as the car comes to a stop very quickly.

I just need to bear in mind that unless I'm working my brakes as well as I'm working the engine, then I may not stop in time.

When you say useless - can you still lock the wheels? Or is it they lock at differing pedal presure.

This is one thing that Walshy days are great for - learning how to brake in an non assisted car and practicing emergency stops/hard braking which most folk don't.


Cheers


Mac

Yep, the wheels will still lock (then ABS unlocks them), it could be ABS is too premature at low speeds actually. The car just goes on for far longer than it should if I jam on the anchors at speeds below 40 or 50.

That's technique then. You're being to aggressive and slamming them - letting the ABS do the work. That's not what it's there for - it's a safety net. The ABS will stop you in a longer distance than proper threshold braking (braking to the point of ABS kicking in, without it actually doing so) ABS is there to let you steer in what would be a lockup situation, not to slow you quicker than correct braking. That's magnified in a light car like the Elise.

I

[simon]

Lotus do them as well if you've not got any left - they actually work (unlike the Eliseparts ones) and only cost pennies...

Not true I'm afraid, they cost a tenner for 4 sticky bits of rubber!

I know what you're saying about the control and yes you could maybe say I'm missing the point but you are missing mine too! My point is that Walshy doesn't teach you to be a safer road driver. He helps give you the control to recover once you've fcuk it up, whether that's your own fault or brought on by someone elses actions. I'm quite conscious of my surroundings when I drive e.g. I move to the middle of the road when I pass junctions in case something pulls out. Defensive driving and avoiding the situations that may cause you to lose control are what make you a safer road driver IMO, not just the ability to fix it once you've gone beyond the limit.

I don't drive anywhere near the limit of my car on the road and I personally don't want to be anywhere near anyone that does, regardless of how many Walshy days they've done. If that makes me slower as a road driver, I don't care, I'm still enjoying it and at the end of the day, that's what it's all about.

[Shug]

Lotus do them as well if you've not got any left - they actually work (unlike the Eliseparts ones) and only cost pennies...

Not true I'm afraid, they cost a tenner for 4 sticky bits of rubber!

Jeez, that's changed. Used to be a couple of quid.... Still, they do work if the caliper is cleaned before application (Geary's seem to drop off with the heat)

I know what you're saying about the control and yes you could maybe say I'm missing the point but you are missing mine too! My point is that Walshy doesn't teach you to be a safer road driver. He helps give you the control to recover once you've fcuk it up, whether that's your own fault or brought on by someone elses actions. I'm quite conscious of my surroundings when I drive e.g. I move to the middle of the road when I pass junctions in case something pulls out. Defensive driving and avoiding the situations that may cause you to lose control are what make you a safer road driver IMO, not just the ability to fix it once you've gone beyond the limit.

I don't drive anywhere near the limit of my car on the road and I personally don't want to be anywhere near anyone that does, regardless of how many Walshy days they've done. If that makes me slower as a road driver, I don't care, I'm still enjoying it and at the end of the day, that's what it's all about.

Okay - I get where you're coming from now.

FWIW, he used to do exactly that on-road, but I think the insurance situation got out of control. You can't really teach that on an airfield, so I see exactly what you mean.

It's a real shame that he doesn't do the on-road stuff anymore as I'm sure it's closer to achieving what he wants (as Neil says, to create safer road drivers) The track thing seems to be where he can earn his living, so I suppose you can't blame him for shifting towards it when the road stuff got tougher to do and every day he does sells out....

[simon]

The ABS will stop you in a longer distance than proper threshold braking (braking to the point of ABS kicking in, without it actually doing so) ABS is there to let you steer in what would be a lockup situation, not to slow you quicker than correct braking. That's magnified in a light car like the Elise.

I

Most people don't actually realise that is what ABS does. Realistically, ABS will stop a car quicker than most average drivers but a very good driver can stop a car shorter. Doesn't walshy show the difference on his DVD?

[Shug]

The ABS will stop you in a longer distance than proper threshold braking (braking to the point of ABS kicking in, without it actually doing so) ABS is there to let you steer in what would be a lockup situation, not to slow you quicker than correct braking. That's magnified in a light car like the Elise.

I

Most people don't actually realise that is what ABS does. Realistically, ABS will stop a car quicker than most average drivers but a very good driver can stop a car shorter. Doesn't walshy show the difference on his DVD?

Most average drivers in a panic situation, yeah. He does show the difference in the DVD. Pretty interesting stuff.

You don't have to be that fantastic to stop quicker than ABS, although FWIW, the Elise system is one of the best on the market.

[GregR]

Mr walsh has a vid?

[ed]

yep its called bending the rules. ive got it if you would like to borrow it! cheers ed

[Tom]

Mr walsh has a vid?

a dvd. you can buy off the website http://www.carlimits.com about a tenner.
there is the option of course of a copy, but my opinion is that some people/businesses are worth supporting so I would buy a legit copy. but that's just me

[GregR]

yep its called bending the rules. ive got it if you would like to borrow it! cheers ed

cheers Ed, your bro is a pain sometimes

[ed]

[Rag_It]

Aye squire i couldnt find that the other night - i believe i begged and scrounged for that copy!

Be a good lad and bring it over!

[simon]

You can have mine if you want, I'll bring it tomorrow.

[mckeann]

Mr walsh has a vid?

a dvd. you can buy off the website http://www.carlimits.com about a tenner.
there is the option of course of a copy, but my opinion is that some people/businesses are worth supporting so I would buy a legit copy. but that's just me

i would agree with you there tom, but again, theres not many damn decent guys around like us.

[Shug]

Mr walsh has a vid?

a dvd. you can buy off the website http://www.carlimits.com about a tenner.
there is the option of course of a copy, but my opinion is that some people/businesses are worth supporting so I would buy a legit copy. but that's just me

i would agree with you there tom, but again, theres not many damn decent guys around like us.

Thirded.... I could have had a copy, but spent folding... Having said that, I daresay the welsh wizard has made the filming costs back by now...