Concorde Experience at Museum of Flight, East Fortune

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woody
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Post by woody » Tue Apr 10, 2007 11:24 pm

campbell wrote:Now here's a thing...do you think, crash apart, that engine technology 30-odd years could have provided more efficient and/or quieter engines to enable Concorde to keep flying whilst upsetting fewer residents and becoming more commercial viable through reduced fuel usage?
probably not.

More efficent & or quieter engine needs a high bypass fan(like on a normal airliner) where as concorde uses a turbojet like a fast jet. This has a small fan.

The noise making part of the engine is the turbine core - and the large flow of cool fan air (80% fan 20% turbine core on a normal high bypass fan) shrouds the noise of the core.

Also, the bigger the fan, the more thrust can be produced and therefore the same core engine can be much more efficent with a large fan than without.

With a turbofan engine though, there's too much frontal area for supersonic speeds amongst other issues (think harrier compared to F16). No doubt there are far better engines of the same type as the olympus out there now (with boltless turbines, powder metal tech and 3D turbine aero section & more efficent combustors) but the noise fuel issues still stand pretty much unaltered.

have a look here for the latest in gas turbine tech 8) Hoping to get out to the states in a few months to work on these before they go into service on the new boeing. If not we'll have one over here early next year.
Last edited by woody on Tue Apr 10, 2007 11:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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David Bryce
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Post by David Bryce » Tue Apr 10, 2007 11:30 pm

eh? what? i'm a numpty? or just drunk?

not understanding a word of that, what do you do for a living Woody?

thank god cameras are easy to understand :wink:

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Post by woody » Tue Apr 10, 2007 11:34 pm

David Bryce wrote:eh? what? i'm a numpty? or just drunk?

not understanding a word of that, what do you do for a living Woody?

thank god cameras are easy to understand :wink:
erm, build jet engines Image :wink:

ETA: I got a Nikon D50 in November, still haven't got a clue how to use it beyond auto :!:
Last edited by woody on Tue Apr 10, 2007 11:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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jason
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Post by jason » Tue Apr 10, 2007 11:41 pm

SWMBO and I went into Concorde's hangar after last year's airshow. I agree, it is indeed beautifully displayed, and it's great to be able to walk around and touch her.

Was also nice to see her complete again after witnessing her fuselage-only :cry: arrival in April '04 across the fields.

East Fortune was also the R34 Airship's New York-bound departure point from the UK IIRC. I *think* the R34 hangar is Concorde's home now... so that's two VERY different speeds of getting to New York had/have homes under the same roof :)

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David Bryce
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Post by David Bryce » Wed Apr 11, 2007 12:04 am

ETA: I got a Nikon D50 in November, still haven't got a clue how to use it beyond auto
if you promise not to confuse me with jet engine stuff, I will explain how to use your D50 properly :wink:

woody
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Post by woody » Wed Apr 11, 2007 12:14 am

David Bryce wrote:
ETA: I got a Nikon D50 in November, still haven't got a clue how to use it beyond auto
if you promise not to confuse me with jet engine stuff, I will explain how to use your D50 properly :wink:
Deal :thumbsup

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campbell
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Post by campbell » Wed Apr 11, 2007 8:21 am

Woody,

Great response - thanks! I used to be a bit keen on planes n stuff as a kid, and although I grew out of it (!), I am still fascinated by how it all happens and how clever them engineer types (ie you!) can be :-) I built a couple of airfix Concordes with my Dad's help. It was such a novel shape back then.

I really hoped Branson could have pulled something off to rescue a Concorde, but looked like even his winning smile couldn't shift the Suits.

We can just be grateful that Alpha Alpha is stationed here in bonnie Scotland for us all to marvel at. The Concorde project spent long enough being tested in the skies around our shores, we deserve it!

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GregR
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Post by GregR » Wed Apr 11, 2007 8:28 am

I saw the airfield from afar last year when we did the East Fortune trackday last year...

I would love to do it again, please somebody bring it back :(
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dezzy
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Post by dezzy » Wed Apr 11, 2007 9:12 am

Well, how's this for a prompt response . . . Amanda just called me about my email this morning!

One of her colleagues is going to email me regarding a group discount for visiting the museum (Concorde experience included). I'll need to get an idea of numbers for that, so will set up a poll. We'll also need to look at dates. She's going to suggest a couple to me, but I was thinking sometime in June?

Regarding the photos, we've got two possibilities:

Concorde Photos

She said that she has to be very careful with her relationship with BA when it comes to the Concorde and it would need to be an official press photo shoot for us to get access for photos of the cars next to the Concorde. She said if it was an official shoot for a magazine article or something, she could maybe sort that out. Does anyone have any ideas for this? Any car magazine contacts? One of my friends is a photographer for the Evening Times and Herald, so I'll have a chat to him about it and see if we can come up with any ideas. Any suggestions would be appreciated!

Outdoor Photos

No problem getting some outdoor photos, perhaps next to the Vulcan or something. She's a bit cautious about removing barriers and letting us under the planes as there's obviously a H&S risk, but said we could work something out if we came first thing in the morning before lots of visitors arrived. She just needs to make sure she's got enough staff around to remove barriers for us and make sure we don't end up with a plane on top of the cars!

I suggested that we go up and have a look to see what the best locations would be and have a chat to her about the photos/barriers/safety aspects. She's on holiday from 19th April to 8th May, so sometime after that would be good.

Campbell, do you fancy coming up with me? And one of our resident photographer experts? I could also bring along my professional photographer friend I mentioned above.

Let me know what you think.

Cheers,
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Rag_It
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Post by Rag_It » Wed Apr 11, 2007 9:16 am

David Bryce wrote:
ETA: I got a Nikon D50 in November, still haven't got a clue how to use it beyond auto
if you promise not to confuse me with the art of selling stuff, I will explain how to use your D50 properly :wink:
Good man! As mentioned in a thread last year, would love some proper tuition on Aperture, Shutter speed, panning properly etc etc, bought a really good field guide that you should have a read of Woody, but i think half an hour of David's time at KH would be ace!

Dave :thumbsup

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MacK
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Post by MacK » Wed Apr 11, 2007 9:17 am

All sounds good Dezzy.

Well done for you making the calls and Amanda getting back in touch so quickly.
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campbell
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Post by campbell » Wed Apr 11, 2007 10:02 am

Dezzy,

Great stuff.

Absolutely, more than happy to come along and do a recce...and I'll hook up with Cameron and get him along with us to help represent the "Amateur" photographer faction ;-) Who are our "professional" reps going to be then?!

When were you thinking of? I have actually already pencilled in this coming Saturday to intercept the Borders Se7ens on their visit (!) as an excuse to get out for a few hours with Eilidh, and give Mum a bit of time off. But if another date is required, let's discuss.

Aiming for June for the real visit is probably fine, although given holiday season approaching, probably well worth identifying 2-3 potential dates, polling, and selecting the one with most take-up. Well, that's my consensus-management style, others will suggest just to pick a date - I don't actually mind and if I personally can't make it, not to worry. Just nice to help arrange something a bit different for the community.

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jason
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Post by jason » Wed Apr 11, 2007 10:26 am

I'm guessing it will be Linda de Costa who contacts you from the museum. I'm organising the group booking and permission to park next to the Vulcan for the Borders7 trip this coming Sat (I live only 5 mins away), and she is my point of contact. The folk at the museum are incredibly helpful :thumbsup

Yes, the barriers will spoil any photos (all the outdoor exhibit aircraft are surrounded by pedestrian barriers - ~100+m of barrier round each 'plane) so if you could get them removed early am that'd be very worthwhile.

Speaking to/meeting her again today - so I'll be happy to share any experiences that would help SE's visit planning :D

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woody
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Post by woody » Wed Apr 11, 2007 11:22 am

NOOPS 160 wrote:
woody wrote:
David Bryce wrote:eh? what? i'm a numpty? or just drunk?

not understanding a word of that, what do you do for a living Woody?

thank god cameras are easy to understand :wink:
erm, build jet engines Image :wink:

ETA: I got a Nikon D50 in November, still haven't got a clue how to use it beyond auto :!:
Err I do hope some of the engines you work on run a little better than your 160 :shock: :lol: :lol: :wink:
I no nothing about camera's either :roll:
Wouldn't be hard :roll: :lol: Though i could tell you some stories....

Likeing the text speak Neil, very wid it :wink:

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campbell
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Post by campbell » Wed Apr 11, 2007 11:24 am

jasonliddell wrote:I'm guessing it will be Linda de Costa who contacts you from the museum. I'm organising the group booking and permission to park next to the Vulcan for the Borders7 trip this coming Sat (I live only 5 mins away), and she is my point of contact. The folk at the museum are incredibly helpful :thumbsup
Jason,

Aha, good to make the connection with you as Saturday's organiser!

If I make it along, I will try to track you down to say hello. I'll hopefully be in my silver S1 Elise, reg UJI xxxx, with wee girl Eilidh in tow :-)

cheers

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