looking at s160

tut · Post by **tut** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 11:41 am

John

The Emerald ECU is £650 inclusive.

tut

Victor Meldrew · Post by **Victor Meldrew** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 12:48 pm

tut wrote:John

The Emerald ECU is £650 inclusive.

tut

FFS...

Still, £1000 should get you a set of cams, an emerald, a set of verniers. Still think its a better option than changing the car..

hiscot · Post by **hiscot** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 1:10 pm

I know off an add for a elise 160 factory updated /refurb ecu with lead software disc dongle and remapped with the piper cams (inc dizy drive ) he is wanting £550 + post

other than that qed sell great kits
dont forget a emerald will require mapping

Post by **Shug** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 7:33 pm

Craig, gimme a shout if you want a natter about options...

In a nutshell, your 135 is a ported standard head. Options for this, while keeping it in 1 piece, inlcude a cam swap a la Rich Humble. Should see you with a decent 150/160hp, probably keeping the MEMS. Do a few other things (like decent manifold and bigger TB) and you'll get useful power hike for not a huge amount of cash.

Further than that, I'd strongly advise looking beyond the standard head casting - going for either a VVC or PTP (VHPD) head, which has far superior valve sizes and port shapes.

Then you've got Emeralds & DTH Throttle Bodies & the like...

Also, don't discount finding a used VVC engine and dropping it in - now that I've found the pitfalls with doing one, there's a source of info on doing it.

You could quite easily get a useful 170/180 bhp for less than the cost of swapping - what way you go about this depends on the sort of power delivery you're after.

Post by **Shug** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 8:36 pm

shooomer wrote:Thinking out loud

IMHO the Sport 135 is probably one of the most desirable S1 Elises if left fairly standard.

I think you'd probably notice a bigger difference in performance upgrading Sport 135 than swapping to a Sport 160 however any money spent on mods is basically lost if you sell vehicle.

You could probably swap to Sport 160 for ~£2k.

Although....

The majority of the perceived speed gain is thanks to the standard CR box on the 135 - which is missing on the 160. Betcha the 160, with the peaky delivery and long box will actually feel slower....

Victor Meldrew · Post by **Victor Meldrew** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 10:41 pm

So.... a moded 135 could be be a fair bit quicker than a 160....

Dont know enough about the PTP to say if the 135 Janspeed head is any better than their head.. cant be much in it though, a ported head is a ported head. After that if fall to the valve sizes and valve springs I would have thought.

And if you keep the bits when you convert, you can go back to std when you sell the car on, then sell the bits on here to get some money back.

From my conversation with someone in the know (Dan at JUDE) you "need" verniers and an emerald to unlock the real potential of a 160.
So if you take that into account, all you need to duplicate? a 160 starting from a 135 as a base is a set of cams.... ..or is my logic just a bit out?

P.S. I am planning a cam swap for next summer, but dont tell Lesley. I have to come out with the "the std ones are worn and need replacing, its a high stressed engine you know, these things happen..!!!!"

Victor Meldrew · Post by **Victor Meldrew** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 11:27 pm

NOOPS 160 wrote:
John Reid wrote:So.... a moded 135 could be be a fair bit quicker than a 160....

Dont know enough about the PTP to say if the 135 Janspeed head is any better than their head.. cant be much in it though, a ported head is a ported head. After that if fall to the valve sizes and valve springs I would have thought.

And if you keep the bits when you convert, you can go back to std when you sell the car on, then sell the bits on here to get some money back.

From my conversation with someone in the know (Dan at JUDE) you "need" verniers and an emerald to unlock the real potential of a 160.
So if you take that into account, all you need to duplicate? a 160 starting from a 135 as a base is a set of cams.... ..or is my logic just a bit out?

P.S. I am planning a cam swap for next summer, but dont tell Lesley. I have to come out with the "the std ones are worn and need replacing, its a high stressed engine you know, these things happen..!!!!"
Verniers and emerald according to Dan would transform the 160 ........ 135 pahhh.sorry John

as above with a cam swap for me, shouldnt be much of a difference.

it all comes down to how hard you pedal in the end...

mac · Post by **mac** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 8:23 am

Craig,

I think you'll find that PTP did the porting work for lotus on the S1 - 135 & 160 heads.

I've found them to be sound folk - drop them a line for their input

craigs135s · Post by **craigs135s** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 10:47 pm

Christ so quite alot i can do to my car then. Thanks for all the input chaps will prob give a few people a call. Will let you all know what i deside on

Cheers
Craig

Post by **Shug** » Fri Oct 06, 2006 10:18 am

John Reid wrote:So.... a moded 135 could be be a fair bit quicker than a 160....

Dont know enough about the PTP to say if the 135 Janspeed head is any better than their head.. cant be much in it though, a ported head is a ported head. After that if fall to the valve sizes and valve springs I would have thought.

Ah, but apples and oranges. If you're talking the PTP 170 head, that's not a standard casting. The 135 & 160 start out as standard K castings then are ported out. The PTP 170 is a VHPD head, which is actually the same port shapes and valve sizes as the VVC - much better even as a bare casting than you could ever get from porting a standard head - the port shapes are miles better, straight out the mold.

Re valve sizes, the biggest inlet valves I could get in my standard head inserts was 29.5mm - the VHPD and VVC inlet valves are 32mm as standard.

Post by **Shug** » Fri Oct 06, 2006 10:18 am

mac wrote:Craig,

I think you'll find that PTP did the porting work for lotus on the S1 - 135 & 160 heads.

I've found them to be sound folk - drop them a line for their input

Janspeed did the first 135 heads....

mac · Post by **mac** » Fri Oct 06, 2006 2:41 pm

Shug wrote:
mac wrote:Craig,

I think you'll find that PTP did the porting work for lotus on the S1 - 135 & 160 heads.

I've found them to be sound folk - drop them a line for their input
Janspeed did the first 135 heads....

What they did the first 135 heads for the 135 or the did the first run of heads for the 135?

what about the 160 - did they do 160 of them, or the first run for the 160 or none at all?

Mac

Victor Meldrew · Post by **Victor Meldrew** » Fri Oct 06, 2006 9:55 pm

I am sure Janspeed did the first run, i.e. first 50 heads on the original batch of 50 SVA type approved 135's

They have a Janspeed exhaust manifold and back box as well I think.... well mine does....

robin · Post by **robin** » Sat Oct 07, 2006 6:55 am

John Reid wrote:I am sure Janspeed did the first run, i.e. first 50 heads on the original batch of 50 SVA type approved 135's

They have a Janspeed exhaust manifold and back box as well I think.... well mine does....

I am 99% sure that the 135 heads are CNC machined, so provided you have a proper machine, the differences between sources are negligable. Of course you might still have a swiss cheese head, but that's nought to do with the 135 conversion.

Cheers,
Robin

woody · Post by **woody** » Sat Oct 07, 2006 9:28 pm

I can only echo what's been said above about the S160's driving characteristics. They're not exactly ideal every day.

If you want a go in one, your welcome to pop in to killie on the way by for a shot of mine.

woody