Footage of Bianchi's crash

[Shug]

I agree, the green flag is correct, I remember noticing it during the race from an on board shot, and thinking it looked odd, then realising it was after the accident.

Some serious speed being carried in there, and a LOT of movement on that JCB considering its weight. My brain still tells me the car should be travelling backwards though!

yup, he was clearly going way too fast (remember, it was under double waved yellows - ie, be prepared to stop).

can see what you mean about the direction, my guess is he had already done a 360 before we see it, and had managed to get it back to straight, but in the process simply ran out of room.

Do they brake into Dunlop after the esses these days (this was the crash site, wasn't it?)

Brake failure, or massive front lockup and no steering authority, so spearing straight to the accident once hitting grass/gravel? Looked like an arrow straight trajectory from the video from the point he enters frame and there seems to have been little to no retardation...

Just guesswork at the end of the day until (if) we get a more full explanation. Given the team have said nothing about a failure, my finger in the air guess would be him going too fast under waved yellows (in prep to get back on it after the green), perhaps a mis-read of another car on track's pace - massive panic lockup, onto grass, straight to the scene. Or similar, without the other car involved. Basically - driver error. Which, given his condition, they won't be keen to bring up right now.

[Mikie711]

Sutil was still backwards and sliding across the grass before hitting the barrier but his speed was way less than Bianchi's. If had spun I would have thought he would have scrubbed off more speed than that. It looked like he hit the JCB at near full race pace and he should have been considerably slower than that if he ever hoped to get round the corner. Pity there is no video of his approach to the corner to maybe explain what was happening before hand.
Shug, is that not the escape road he is on. Thought Sutil skipped across the escape road onto the grass before hitting the barrier, Bianchi went straight up the road.
Hope he makes a full and speedy recovery.

[David]

To see the yellow/green flag in context it is best to look at the whole video here: http://www.f1today.net/en/news/bvideob- ... es-bianchi. The double yellow was replaced by a green only a few seconds before the crash. Technically that may be correct as the tractor was moving past the post but might have given the drivers the wrong impression that the incident was cleared.

[Corranga]

The yellow to green sectors are marked to avoid as much confusion as possible. As the tractor moved past the post, the marshal changed the flag to indicate that the track ahead was green, and to remove any confusion as to whether the track ahead still poses a danger. Also remember that, beyond these flags, there are also flashing light around the circuit (probably more relevant given conditions) and I think possibly steering wheel lights too, so I doubt the flag man was even being looked at.

I think what is happening at the moment is a terrible accident occurred and lots of people are looking to point fingers, to the marshal, to race control, to Marussia having him out the on inters, to the FIA using tractors and letting the race happen in the first place, when the reality is that either something failed on Bianchi's car, or he simply made a mistake which lead him to the scene. Hindsight is a dangerous thing, as is motor sport!

All we can do now is hope for a full recovery.

On another note, it looks like, had the tractor not been there, he was heading straight out the escape road and into a concrete wall, though that might just be a camera angles thing.

[Shug]

Hindsight is a dangerous thing, as is motor sport!

All we can do now is hope for a full recovery.

Spot on.

[tut]

Nobody saw Bianchi's car even after it had crashed.

Sutil's was shown going in and him then climbing out OK. The first time that there seemed to be something wrong was when the medical car went shooting down, and then you could just see part of the bodywork of another car.

tut

[Shug]

Nobody saw Bianchi's car even after it had crashed.

Sutil's was shown going in and him then climbing out OK. The first time that there seemed to be something wrong was when the medical car went shooting down, and then you could just see part of the bodywork of another car.

tut

You've clicked the youtube link in the first post of this thread, yes?

[tut]

Just watched it live again Shug.

They were showing Sutil's car being recovered near the end of lap 43, you can see the marshaller who shortly after jumped for his life, and the green flag being waved on the stand. 45 secs after that the medical car goes out on lap 44, so it looked as if they missed Bianchi's car going off by about 10 secs. They then zeroed in again 2min after they had last shown it, and the tail of his car is just showing jutting out.

tut

[jason]

To see the yellow/green flag in context it is best to look at the whole video here: http://www.f1today.net/en/news/bvideob- ... es-bianchi. The double yellow was replaced by a green only a few seconds before the crash. Technically that may be correct as the tractor was moving past the post but might have given the drivers the wrong impression that the incident was cleared.

Concerning/confusing is the fact it appears a marshall is still at the original accident site, back-turned, picking up debris adjacent to the barrier Sutil struck... when the green is waved. He's obviously not beyond the accident site, and not beyond where whatever being moved out the way (Sutil's suspended car being the farthest danger) originally prompted that post to be double-yellow...

Hindsight is a wonderful thing, and hindsight questions why María de Villota's terrible accident didn't trigger the fitting of skirts of some kind (who knows, perhaps that has already been under review since then) around anything that a car could strike/submarine within a circuit. It would also seem logical for any vehicles to always flash amber lights when within the circuit - as a last resort to warming drivers - this tractor doesn't have one.


But this doesn't help Bianchi I hope he makes a full recovery.

[Shug]

Just watched it live again Shug.

They were showing Sutil's car being recovered near the end of lap 43, you can see the marshaller who shortly after jumped for his life, and the green flag being waved on the stand. 45 secs after that the medical car goes out on lap 44, so it looked as if they missed Bianchi's car going off by about 10 secs. They then zeroed in again 2min after they had last shown it, and the tail of his car is just showing jutting out.

tut

Tut, the youtube link at the start of this thread shows the reverse angle, as taken by a fan in the stands. We're not discussing what was shown on TV. It's sickeningly clear, although misses the start of the incident.

Edit - although it now looks as if the FIA have had it pulled.

[tut]

Just watched David's video above and that shows exactly what happened.

The first video which I did watch, has now been removed.

tut

[graeme]

Closed cockpits in F1:

https://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/news/for ... 9--f1.html

Regardless of Bianchi's incident (i.e. trying not to knee-jerk) what do y'all think? It seems like a logical next step to me, and it hasn't harmed my enjoyment of WEC (Fuji this weekend btw!), and F1 aesthetics went out the window years ago.

Is it still F1 for you if it's open wheel, but closed cockpit? I don't think I'd mind.

[vet111s]

Without some kind of massively strong framework I don't know if a closed cockpit would have made much difference at the weekend.
I think even a touring car would have been in a bad way. On the upside, it does look like the actual cockpit area may have only had a (big) glancing blow. I think if it had been any more we would be discussing things differently

[thinfourth]

Not much could of survived going into the ballast box of a JCB at speed as that bit is basically a massive steel casting for a counter balance

No racing machine on this planet could run into the back of a JCB without some serious risk of injury to the driver

[graeme]

http://formerf1doc.wordpress.com/2014/10/07/2271/