Chatted to Simon A about this - but was unclear about the supposed issues with s1 Exiges. Always been drawn to them - far more than other Elise/Exige variants - but have heard bad stories about engine rebuild intervals, break downs, blown engines etc. Which are a little worrying!
Can anyone please give light to what exactly the problems are - whether its head rebuilds, premature bore wear, gasket failure etc...? And it's worth asking what maintenance can be taken to prevent the above issues from happening!
Thanks!
Reliability of s1 Exiges?
Basically, the issue with the S1 Exige is that it's a limited road edition of the one make racecar (that lasted 2 seasons)
The engine is a slightly detuned track engine (177 spec) that will require rebuilt around every 30k miles (if not sooner) Remap and time for proper performance (177 was only to get through type approval) and you'll see 190bhp. That's over 100bhp per litre from a bored and stroked 1.4l Metro engine (no variable valve timing here). Rings will wear, bores ovalise, head gaskets go - it's at the limit of it's design capacity (as a mass-produced example anyway)
Plenty of owners use them every day and have no issues, you just have to bear in mind that it's not designed as a commuting car (lumpy idle, track suspension and usually semi-slick track tyres)
Get a good one and you'll fall in love (ask JJ) but go in with your eyes open about it's original design brief, or you'll probably be disappointed.
The engine is a slightly detuned track engine (177 spec) that will require rebuilt around every 30k miles (if not sooner) Remap and time for proper performance (177 was only to get through type approval) and you'll see 190bhp. That's over 100bhp per litre from a bored and stroked 1.4l Metro engine (no variable valve timing here). Rings will wear, bores ovalise, head gaskets go - it's at the limit of it's design capacity (as a mass-produced example anyway)
Plenty of owners use them every day and have no issues, you just have to bear in mind that it's not designed as a commuting car (lumpy idle, track suspension and usually semi-slick track tyres)
Get a good one and you'll fall in love (ask JJ) but go in with your eyes open about it's original design brief, or you'll probably be disappointed.
2010 Honda VFR1200F
1990 Honda VFR400 NC30
2000 Honda VTR1000 SP1
2000 Kawasaki ZX-7R
1990 Honda VFR400 NC30
2000 Honda VTR1000 SP1
2000 Kawasaki ZX-7R
Most I've seen have around 20-35k miles on them, which probably explains why they're for sale. A guess for a rebuild (assuming that the rebuild is to the exact same spec and previous mapping isn't made redundant) - 1.5-2k at a specialist? What engine is in them exactly? Metro..?
It'd be a second car, garaged for the rest. 25-30k miles aren't racked up in a weekend, but it is a little mad. Hmmm... Are they generally reliable within the intervals (without the 190 mods)?
It'd be a second car, garaged for the rest. 25-30k miles aren't racked up in a weekend, but it is a little mad. Hmmm... Are they generally reliable within the intervals (without the 190 mods)?
The rebuilt would usually cost ITRO 1.5k by someone respectable.
The engine is a Rover K series VHPD - designed for a Rover 25 one-make championship just before the BMW takeover. Has been used in a variety of cars from hot Loti, to Caterham's R400s. Only thing that remains of a standard K really is the block - liners, crank, rods, pistons, head etc are all VHPD special items.
Get it built properly though, and you can see over 200bhp with the same sort of reliability as the factory 190s, allegedly (can/worms)
The engine is a Rover K series VHPD - designed for a Rover 25 one-make championship just before the BMW takeover. Has been used in a variety of cars from hot Loti, to Caterham's R400s. Only thing that remains of a standard K really is the block - liners, crank, rods, pistons, head etc are all VHPD special items.
Get it built properly though, and you can see over 200bhp with the same sort of reliability as the factory 190s, allegedly (can/worms)
2010 Honda VFR1200F
1990 Honda VFR400 NC30
2000 Honda VTR1000 SP1
2000 Kawasaki ZX-7R
1990 Honda VFR400 NC30
2000 Honda VTR1000 SP1
2000 Kawasaki ZX-7R
Are there many places in Scotland that are used for such rebuilds? I wouldn't go near a stealership for that personally. £1.5 isn't desirable but not that bad. So when you think you're getting blow by - get your wallet out!
Excuse my ignorance but what is VHPD? Are the crank, rods, head etc nto shared with any other variant? And a good time to ask what the 190bhp mod 'package' includes exactly?
Defining 'reliable' LOL! VAG engines are usually over engineered, so at base level they should be reliable. Well the older stuff is (was), the new parts they're churning out seem to be hit and miss. I own a 16year old car as it is - and its generally great (when I stop tinkering with it) - but not always reliable due to age, so Lotus 'reliability' should be very familiar in a round about way
Just need to decide whether the s1 exige engine is too fragile enough for my liking.
Excuse my ignorance but what is VHPD? Are the crank, rods, head etc nto shared with any other variant? And a good time to ask what the 190bhp mod 'package' includes exactly?
Defining 'reliable' LOL! VAG engines are usually over engineered, so at base level they should be reliable. Well the older stuff is (was), the new parts they're churning out seem to be hit and miss. I own a 16year old car as it is - and its generally great (when I stop tinkering with it) - but not always reliable due to age, so Lotus 'reliability' should be very familiar in a round about way
Just need to decide whether the s1 exige engine is too fragile enough for my liking.Think of it as a posh kit car, rather than a production car and you'll be in the right ballpark. Sh*t falls off occasionally, but it's usually not terminal and (in the case of the Rover engined cars) can also be sorted yourself if you're of a spannering persuasion.
Very High Performance Derivative (crap name, alright engine) The head is basically the internal casting from the 1.8 VVC (bigger valves, much better port sizes and shapes) with the standard K external casting. Nothing is shared, pistons are forged (which you'd swap for Omegas ar Accrelites if you needed to anyway)
Nobody is ever going to call a tuned K series (which is basically what a VHPD is) reliable, but most things can be fixed with little hassle. Dreadnought in Callendar have built the odd missile-spec K series and really know their stuff - if pushed, I'd say that would be your best route for a refresh in Scotland. Ricky Gauld up in Aberdeenshire has quite a lot of experience too.
Have a look at this website http://www.dvapower.com and click the K series engine page link. Gives you a huge amount of info on the K and it's variants. Prepare to lose a couple of hours reading though
Very High Performance Derivative (crap name, alright engine) The head is basically the internal casting from the 1.8 VVC (bigger valves, much better port sizes and shapes) with the standard K external casting. Nothing is shared, pistons are forged (which you'd swap for Omegas ar Accrelites if you needed to anyway)
Nobody is ever going to call a tuned K series (which is basically what a VHPD is) reliable, but most things can be fixed with little hassle. Dreadnought in Callendar have built the odd missile-spec K series and really know their stuff - if pushed, I'd say that would be your best route for a refresh in Scotland. Ricky Gauld up in Aberdeenshire has quite a lot of experience too.
Have a look at this website http://www.dvapower.com and click the K series engine page link. Gives you a huge amount of info on the K and it's variants. Prepare to lose a couple of hours reading though
2010 Honda VFR1200F
1990 Honda VFR400 NC30
2000 Honda VTR1000 SP1
2000 Kawasaki ZX-7R
1990 Honda VFR400 NC30
2000 Honda VTR1000 SP1
2000 Kawasaki ZX-7R
must be another make & type of car. Noops & Co are always going on about the mighty S1 new pistons - should have known a rebuild was always going to be that little bit more! Accrelite pistons are apparently fantastic, some VW tuners use them, but on FI engines.
I looked at the page - first thoughts - thank **** they don't make web pages like that nowadays I'll have a good look through tough - thanks for pointing it out! Plenty of info on shortcomings too - and associated mods which is useful. I am (unfortunately) of a spannering persuasion so I can't help but mess about under the bonnet (boot). Should be cheaper than a blown engine too.
And thanks for the help so far
I looked at the page - first thoughts - thank **** they don't make web pages like that nowadays
I'll have a good look through tough - thanks for pointing it out! Plenty of info on shortcomings too - and associated mods which is useful. I am (unfortunately) of a spannering persuasion so I can't help but mess about under the bonnet (boot). Should be cheaper than a blown engine too.And thanks for the help so far
No problem.
Oh, rebuild does not = pistons, BTW, just pointing out one of the differences. At most, liners will need changed, unless there are bigger issues - pistons are a weak spot on standard Ks, hence the move to forged on the VHPD.
Oh, and Clarkie - will you laugh when something goes south on your 'ultra-reliable' Jap engine and you've got to pay MMC to fix it? I may
Oh, rebuild does not = pistons, BTW, just pointing out one of the differences.
At most, liners will need changed, unless there are bigger issues - pistons are a weak spot on standard Ks, hence the move to forged on the VHPD.Oh, and Clarkie - will you laugh when something goes south on your 'ultra-reliable' Jap engine and you've got to pay MMC to fix it? I may
2010 Honda VFR1200F
1990 Honda VFR400 NC30
2000 Honda VTR1000 SP1
2000 Kawasaki ZX-7R
1990 Honda VFR400 NC30
2000 Honda VTR1000 SP1
2000 Kawasaki ZX-7R